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Old February 8th   #1
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Study says auto bailout saved 1.4 million jobs



A new study by the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor concludes that the bailout of General Motors and Chrysler in 2009, with $85 billion in taxpayer money going to the two companies to help them survive the restructuring process of managed bankruptcies, saved 1.4 million jobs. The Detroit News reports:



Most of the jobs — 1.14 million — were saved in 2009, during the low-point of the industry’s severe downturn. But another 314,400 were saved in 2010, the Center said Wednesday.

“The government intervention prevented additional personal income losses totaling $71.9 billion for 2009 and $24.6 billion for 2010,” the center said in a statement.

“The net impact to the federal government—in terms of changes in transfer payments, social security receipts and personal income taxes—was $21.6 billion in 2009 and $7 billion in 2010.”

But that is merely the tip of the iceberg. The cost to state and local governments for the sudden increase in Medicaid, unemployment benefits, loss of property taxes and other consequences of allowing the two companies to fail would have been even higher.
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Old February 8th   #2
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I would hope so. Spending hundreds of millions should save jobs. I still don't agree with any business being bailed out. It's called capitalism.
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Old February 8th   #3
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That only averages out to about 75k per job. I doubt many of those holding said jobs make 75 grand a year, so whos pockets is that money in now?

Edit :
To be clear I was using the first figure, 1.14 million in my maths.

Last edited by Tanro; February 8th at 10:20 PM.
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Old February 9th   #4
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It still would have been better to go through bankruptcy in the first place. That way the creditors and shareholders would have been paid before the union and government got paid. And the bankruptcy would have allowed restructuring that would have made the company more competitive. The process they initiated violated the laws on the books by not paying the investors first.
I don't see how you could come up with any accurate figures on "saved" jobs anyway.
The whole mess was corrupt from the start.
My 2¢
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Old February 9th   #5
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The process they initiated violated the laws on the books by not paying the investors first.
Laws shmaws. A crisis is the perfect time to seize power. What has happened to the people guilty of this law breaking? Nothing. A crisis is also the perfect time to abandon your principles. Everyone will understand. If you believe in the free market ***except when it matters***, then you don't really believe in the free market, period.
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Old February 9th   #6
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never let a good crisis go to waste!!
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Old February 10th   #7
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never let a good crisis go to waste!!
lol!
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Old February 11th   #8
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I would hope so. Spending hundreds of millions should save jobs. I still don't agree with any business being bailed out. It's called capitalism.

Companies paying $25 million bonuses shouldn't have layoffs either. I don't agree with tax breaks to big buisness for the purpose of reinvesting to create new jobs but instead monies are used to payout bonuses to top executives. It's called greed. Take your pick, who suffers more?
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Old February 11th   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mailman View Post
It still would have been better to go through bankruptcy in the first place. That way the creditors and shareholders would have been paid before the union and government got paid. And the bankruptcy would have allowed restructuring that would have made the company more competitive. The process they initiated violated the laws on the books by not paying the investors first.
I don't see how you could come up with any accurate figures on "saved" jobs anyway.
The whole mess was corrupt from the start.
My 2¢

I bet the ones who were out of work and unable to put food on the table would disagree with you...
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Old February 11th   #10
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I bet the ones who were out of work and unable to put food on the table would disagree with you...
Lots of people disagree with me. Those people are mostly wrong, ha ha.
We all have our opinions. So far we are free to express them.
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Old February 11th   #11
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Companies paying $25 million bonuses shouldn't have layoffs either. I don't agree with tax breaks to big buisness for the purpose of reinvesting to create new jobs but instead monies are used to payout bonuses to top executives. It's called greed. Take your pick, who suffers more?
It is the executives job to rub the company as efficient as possible. Why would you have employees when the company can be ran more efficient without them. If an executive makes the company a huge profit, then he deserves to rewarded.
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Old February 11th   #12
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It is the executives job to rub the company as efficient as possible. Why would you have employees when the company can be ran more efficient without them. If an executive makes the company a huge profit, then he deserves to rewarded.
I've never seen an executive assemble any part of any vehicle that earns them a profit... nor engineer the mechanics of how a vehicle works. They probably couldn't even read a blueprint to explain how it works. Without employees, the executives wouldn't have a company to "rub"...

I think you fall into that category of followers that believe whatever they hear.
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Old February 11th   #13
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Lots of people disagree with me. Those people are mostly wrong, ha ha.
We all have our opinions. So far we are free to express them.
When hard times and misfortune fall on your doorstep, I feel you too will fall into the ranks of the mostly wrong. I will get a chuckle out of that too.
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Old February 11th   #14
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I've never seen an executive assemble any part of any vehicle that earns them a profit... nor engineer the mechanics of how a vehicle works. They probably couldn't even read a blueprint to explain how it works. Without employees, the executives wouldn't have a company to "rub"...

I think you fall into that category of followers that believe whatever they hear.
I have never saw a football coach run on the field and throw a touchdown pass either, but they are still probably the most important part of the team. Donald trump surely does not have a clue about how tohub old a high rise building, but obviously he knows how to put all the right people together to accomplish it efficiently. That's why he is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it.

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Old February 11th   #15
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I have never saw a football coach run on the field and throw a touchdown pass either, but they are still probably the most important part of the team. Donald trump surely does not have a clue about how tohub old a high rise building, but obviously he knows how to put all the right people together to accomplish it efficiently. That's why he is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it.
Let's think real long and hard on what you're saying in context with what's actually occuring...

Owner of the football team tell the coach he needs to cut 5 of his best players because there's no more money available to support them, but then turns around and pays all the executive board members $200,000 because of a profitable season... I guess that makes sense to you.
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Old February 11th   #16
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Let's think real long and hard on what you're saying in context with what's actually occuring...

Owner of the football team tell the coach he needs to cut 5 of his best players because there's no more money available to support them, but then turns around and pays all the executive board members $200,000 because of a profitable season... I guess that makes sense to you.
The players are taking no risk. It's not their money that is writing the checks. No one is entitled to a job. It's a privilege that is earned. Yep makes sense to me
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Old February 11th   #17
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Donald trump surely does not have a clue about how tohub old a high rise building, but obviously he knows how to put all the right people together to accomplish it efficiently. That's why he is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it.
Donald Trump...

Since Donald Trump is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it, he doesn't deserve any tax breaks, correct?... Since he is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it, his anual income has to be at least $500,000,000, correct?....
If I work 40+ hours a week and make pennies compared to Donald Trump, and I desever every dime of it.... but why do I pay more percetage wise in taxes than Donald Trump? Sure he pays millions of dollars in taxes but the percentage he pays is less than me..... why does this make sense? After he pays his taxes, he still lives without being in need of anything. He and his cohorts that run big business don't want their pocketbooks to be smaller than the previous quarter, so at the slightest inclination of a dip into their profits, they stick it to us, the consumers, that pay more for services rendered with nothing additional added. Anyone feel the bite of cable television increases? Why did the rates go up? Nothing about my service improved. But anyway, on to the rest of my point.... The additional profits earned from price increases plus the percentage wise tax break they received, where is this extra money going? Not to create new jobs, because they are laying off and phasing jobs out, so there's even additional monies added to the profit margin.... Does any of this makes sense to you?
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Old February 11th   #18
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The players are taking no risk. It's not their money that is writing the checks. No one is entitled to a job. It's a privilege that is earned. Yep makes sense to me

Taking no risk? Are you smoking crack? How many players have injuries that ended their careers or developed health problems later on that decreased their quality of life?

And it's people like you that say no one is entitled a job, but complain about people on welfare. Make up your mind, either you want people to work and get off welfare or they aren't entitled to a job and live off us that do have a job....
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Old February 11th   #19
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Donald Trump...

Since Donald Trump is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it, he doesn't deserve any tax breaks, correct?... Since he is worth billions and he deserves every dime of it, his anual income has to be at least $500,000,000, correct?....
If I work 40+ hours a week and make pennies compared to Donald Trump, and I desever every dime of it.... but why do I pay more percetage wise in taxes than Donald Trump? Sure he pays millions of dollars in taxes but the percentage he pays is less than me..... why does this make sense? After he pays his taxes, he still lives without being in need of anything. He and his cohorts that run big business don't want their pocketbooks to be smaller than the previous quarter, so at the slightest inclination of a dip into their profits, they stick it to us, the consumers, that pay more for services rendered with nothing additional added. Anyone feel the bite of cable television increases? Why did the rates go up? Nothing about my service improved. But anyway, on to the rest of my point.... The additional profits earned from price increases plus the percentage wise tax break they received, where is this extra money going? Not to create new jobs, because they are laying off and phasing jobs out, so there's even additional monies added to the profit margin.... Does any of this makes sense to you?
Actually it's simple. Donald trump pays a capital gains tax and you pay and you pay an income tax. That's pretty simple. Secondly, if you don't like the price of your cable, then cancel it.
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Old February 11th   #20
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Taking no risk? Are you smoking crack? How many players have injuries that ended their careers or developed health problems later on that decreased their quality of life?

And it's people like you that say no one is entitled a job, but complain about people on welfare. Make up your mind, either you want people to work and get off welfare or they aren't entitled to a job and live off us that do have a job....
Ok let's try this, financially they have nothing invested in the team. Their paycheck will be the same every week regardless of how successful the team is.
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