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Old May 16th   #1
SaabStory2.0T
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High boost engine miss

So two days ago I started having a rough miss at high boost, and ONLY at high boost. I've read online that bad spark plugs, or not gapped properly, and burnt coils can cause this problem. Haven't had time to check them, but has anyone else had this problem?
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Old May 16th   #2
2SSRSinBama
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probably your plugs... what kind are you running?

what I found with my LNF(2.0L turbo ecotec), was even at 20+psi, don't waste your money buying NGKs, etc... I just got a set of the stock AC Delcos, gapped them tighter to about .030 and called it good, worked to great success for me... you're going to HAVE to change them about every 20,000 miles, i'd check them ever 10k, I was changing them quite often, had an awesome tune, just went through plugs

and that just seems to be common with ecotecs running any kind of boost... just like front o2 sensor near the turbo manifold, about 30,000 miles, and its toast... and on the LNF was a pain to change, set right behind the turbo manifold and was hard to get an o2 socket on

i'm pretty sure your car has the same front o2 sensor, i'd check it if you never have... that too could be it

when mine when out(literally went out), I started my car up one morning and it sounded like someone had broke into my car, pulled the engine out and put in a Box inline-4, sounded just like a WRX, lol
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Last edited by 2SSRSinBama; May 16th at 09:18 PM.
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Old May 16th   #3
SaabStory2.0T
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2SSRSinBama View Post
probably your plugs... what kind are you running?

what I found with my LNF(2.0L turbo ecotec), was even at 20+psi, don't waste your money buying NGKs, etc... I just got a set of the stock AC Delcos, gapped them tighter to about .030 and called it good, worked to great success for me... you're going to HAVE to change them about every 20,000 miles, i'd check them ever 10k, I was changing them quite often, had an awesome tune, just went through plugs

and that just seems to be common with ecotecs running any kind of boost... just like front o2 sensor near the turbo manifold, about 30,000 miles, and its toast... and on the LNF was a pain to change, set right behind the turbo manifold and was hard to get an o2 socket on

i'm pretty sure your car has the same front o2 sensor, i'd check it if you never have... that too could be it

when mine when out(literally went out), I started my car up one morning and it sounded like someone had broke into my car, pulled the engine out and put in a Box inline-4, sounded just like a WRX, lol
Honestly don't know. I haven't had time to check it out since it started, but tomorrow after work I plan on buying new plugs all around. The lot I bought the car from said they had a high boost miss, but they put in some new plugs and voila problem solved. I just dont know which ones they used or if they gapped it right. Most everything I've read says 1.2 mm is what Saab calls for but .9mm is the way to go.

I'm not sure the Balt and Saab used the same motor. I have a B207R, basically the Opel ecotec lk9, but I bet the o2 sensors are the same. I know the coil packs are interchangeable.
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Old May 16th   #4
2SSRSinBama
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that is what they call for, but you are running more boost than stock(right?), if so, you need a tighter gapped plug... that is where your problem is

if it was .9mm, that in standard is 0.035, which is exactly what my car called for stock

however, on 20+ psi .030 was recommended, which is .762mm... i'd do my research, but I am liking my chances of being right on this one


and i'd probably buy this plug:

http://www.familycar.com/store/item/..._AC41-801.html
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS L99
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X-pipe only 13.204 @ 105mph
Headers(no cats), Catback, CAI, SLP UD Pullies, Ported TB, tune

Last edited by 2SSRSinBama; May 16th at 10:32 PM.
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Old May 16th   #5
2SSRSinBama
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mine ran an AC 41-108, but a very similar plug

if you are on the stock boost, i'd stick with what saab says, and with you gapping it less(1.4mm) that'd give the EXACT symptoms you are experiencing

if the plugs are right, and gapped right and you're still getting it: o2 sensor on the turbo side

but i'd check the plugs 1st, the ecotecs like to go through them
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS L99
Cyber Grey Metallic w/ Matte Black stripes
X-pipe only 13.204 @ 105mph
Headers(no cats), Catback, CAI, SLP UD Pullies, Ported TB, tune

Last edited by 2SSRSinBama; May 16th at 10:37 PM.
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Old May 17th   #6
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I made it a habit of regapping the plugs anytime I did an oil change on my 4 cylinder cars since they were so easy to access. I could always tell a difference in how smooth the idle was after the gap was put back in spec.

This was the whole idea behind platinum and iridium plugs--the metal is harder so it would wear less and keep the gap within spec. But there is a slight performance hit.
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Old May 17th   #7
2SSRSinBama
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yeah it was too late last night... you need a tighter gap, but 1.4mm would be a looser/more gap... when I read what I posted last night, I has said 1.4mm was a tighter gap, its not, and not having the plugs gapped tight enough WILL cause a miss(actually a misfire) under boost...

but I still am fairly confident on my math and would say a .762mm or .030 gap is about what you will need, IF you are running more boost than stock...

if you are on the stock boost, i'd go with what Saab says, .9mm or .035

I don't see why they would recommend 1.4mm, if anything, you usually have to tighten the gap of plugs, not go backwards
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2010 Camaro 2SS/RS L99
Cyber Grey Metallic w/ Matte Black stripes
X-pipe only 13.204 @ 105mph
Headers(no cats), Catback, CAI, SLP UD Pullies, Ported TB, tune

Last edited by 2SSRSinBama; May 17th at 12:51 PM.
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Old May 18th   #8
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Update- it was definitely the plugs. The plugs in it weren't gapped right, but I went ahead and replaced them. It was running smoothly until I put my new intake on it. :-| Apparently te company put a busted up plastic emblem in my new filter. I checked it before putting it on and don't did anything in the cone/wrong, but when u hit high boost, the turbo sucked up the pieces and BOOM. Ordered a new turbo last night, hopefully it's running again within a week. I'm so ticked at that company. Geez
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Old May 18th   #9
dmcmahan12
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Dude that freaking sucks! Sorry to hear the bad news. I would contact the intake company and see if they would be willing to help.
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Old May 18th   #10
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Thanks. I'm going to give them a call today on my lunch break. I hope they help out, I bought this other turbo from LKQ, and I'm going to rebuild the turbo I have on the car right now. I can still drive it if I REALLY need to, but me and a buddy broke it down to the turbo last night. The fins on the intake side are bent, and that's all the damage that I can tell. I just don't want to damage it any worse. Sounds like a freakin kazoo at boost.
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Old May 18th   #11
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I read that and boy...I'm mad just thinking about it. They better help you to some degree.

If the fins are bent I would also check for shaft play and see if it is within spec. Just as another check. But rebuilding is the best course of action in this instance anyways.

Why another stock turbo? Why not bigger and just keep the boost to the stock levels? That way when you do upgrade you have the capability already installed?
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Old May 18th   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray View Post
I read that and boy...I'm mad just thinking about it. They better help you to some degree.

If the fins are bent I would also check for shaft play and see if it is within spec. Just as another check. But rebuilding is the best course of action in this instance anyways.

Why another stock turbo? Why not bigger and just keep the boost to the stock levels? That way when you do upgrade you have the capability already installed?
Yeah I was not happy either.

My plans are actually to upgrade the old turbo when I rebuild it. Bigger compressor wheel etc. Should be a pretty cool project. I just wanted something to get me back on the road quickly.
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Old May 18th   #13
dmcmahan12
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I don't know if this will help you but a lot of the Suby guys use them.
http://6starspeed.com/index.html
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Old May 19th   #14
VR4Rob
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Ouch man that sucks!

For rebuilds and upgrades I highly recommend BNR. Bryan is very knowledgeable and just south of here in Bham.

http://bnrsupercars.com/
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Last edited by VR4Rob; May 19th at 08:06 AM.
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Old May 19th   #15
2SSRSinBama
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^ as a former Cobalt guy, I can agree... one of the guys on the Cobalt forums from Huntsville got the BNR Stage II turbo, which is a modified stock K04 turbo, with an upgraded compressor, etc... its a direct bolt-in turbo, as in 100% on the stock manifold, etc... and is cheap, around $1500... full bolt-on, on 93octane and 22psi he put down around 432whp, crazy numbers for a direct bolt-on turbo:

K&N CAI, Injen Charge Piping, ZZP Lower Charge Pipe W/ MAF Relocation, ZZP 3" Catless DP, ZZP Boost Controller,
OTTP Stage 2 Mounts, Tial Q 50mm BOV, BNR 2871

his complete list of mods minus tuning
__________________
2010 Camaro 2SS/RS L99
Cyber Grey Metallic w/ Matte Black stripes
X-pipe only 13.204 @ 105mph
Headers(no cats), Catback, CAI, SLP UD Pullies, Ported TB, tune

Last edited by 2SSRSinBama; May 19th at 10:59 AM.
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Old May 20th   #16
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Awesome info! Thanks guys! The upgrade is going to happen, just not anytime soon. This car is my daily, so I don't want to start "fixing" things until I get something else to putz around in.

The lkq turbo gets here wednesday so I've got a fun project this weekend! I'll keep you posted. Hopefully the replacement goes smoothly. I've never removed a turbo before o.O
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Old May 21st   #17
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Man, this truly sucks. I can't believe that a company designed an intake in such a way that a part coming off would destroy the turbo. I'd definitely put some mesh on the turbo this time before connecting the piping just to keep something like this from happening again.

I've never swapped a turbo either, but my guts tell me to make sure the oil line is working right and change the oil before the swap to have fresh stuff in there. Someone correct me if I'm wrong!
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Old May 21st   #18
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Alright, I'm smart enough to know when to throw in the towel. I can get the the catback off and the downpipe bolts to the turbo off, but I can't get to the manifold. :-(
I probably could move the motor, but I really don't want to dig into my daily driver this deep without something else to drive.

With that being said, what shops do you trust to work on your vehicles? I've got to get it in and get it back by the end of next week at the latest. I've got to be able to drive to work and school. This just blows.
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Old May 22nd   #19
dmcmahan12
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Van Cleef racing.
Van Cleef Racing Enterprises
310 Oldwood Road, Huntsville, AL 35811
(256) 851-1990 ‎
Give them a call and see what they say.
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Old May 24th   #20
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Got it fixed, but I wanted to post a picture of the damage.

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